Inside Job

As a U. of C. grad student, Sudhir Venkatesh talked his way inside a crack-dealing gang at the notorious Robert Taylor Homes and befriended its charismatic leader. Now, in a new book, this "rogue sociologist" tells of his up-close—at times perhaps too close—encounter with gang life

By Michael Stone

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Q: When you first began researching in the projects in September 1989, did you have any idea you'd still be there six years later?
A: No. I had a survey in my hand. I thought if I could talk to 50 kids growing up in different neighborhoods, I could get an understanding of young people's lives and go back to my office after a week or two and go get myself a job.

Q: At what point did the scope of your research change?
A: When I met the parents of these young men in the gang. To this day I'm trying to grasp how they were able to keep their families together while trying to deal with these issues of poverty, crime, people bringing drug money into their home. And I didn't see that my sociology training offered any tools at the time. By that, I mean I was being taught that these were isolated families, families outside American society, and it just didn't look like that to me. These parents were doing all the things my parents were doing, all the things that most parents are doing.

Q: What kinds of things are you talking about?
A: When I met J.T.'s mother, Mrs. Mae, I didn't see a mother who was dealing with a gang leader. I saw a mother who was dealing with a son who had a college degree and who wanted him to be a better person. For example, there was a time when J.T. had beaten up his cousin. [J.T. explained to his mother] that his cousin had stolen drugs, and she sat there and on his terms tried to find a more appropriate way for him of dealing with this. So she said, "Is he a good worker?" And he said, "Yeah, he's a very good worker." "So would you say he made a mistake?" "Yeah, he made a mistake." "Well, you don't want to lose your good workers when they make a mistake, 'cause the world's not filled with very good workers."

So I sat there listening, and I was just perplexed that she was dealing with these issues the way any mother might deal with her children's problems at school or work. I'd been taught this idea, which is what sociologists have, that there's this kind of predator-prey model of a law-abiding element and a criminal element, and they're battling it out in the streets. Well, here we were in one home, and I realized it's a much more complicated process.

Q: Why do you think J.T. was willing to take you into his confidence?
A: I think he was looking for legitimacy from a world that he thought had shunned him, and I was coming from that world that he had just left. [J.T. had worked downtown in a sales job but quit to join the Black Kings because he felt his background was blocking his chances for promotion.] He felt very bitter toward that world. He looked at me as someone who would publicize his opinion, give him a voice.

That changed in two ways. First, I think explaining to me how complicated his decision making was made him feel as though he were more skilled and more adept than even he thought he was. And he was already very egotistical.

The second thing occurred five or six years into my research, around the time the feds began investigating the Black Kings. He came to believe he was going to die or go to jail for the rest of his life. I think it was at that point he became a little more interested in my telling his story than in my being just his spokesperson.

Q: How did you feel about what J.T. did for a living?
A: When I started I thought what J.T. did was heinous. But then my affection for J.T. made me overlook his flaws. Also, I knew if I alienated J.T., I couldn't walk back into the projects. My entire project depended on his goodwill. I was caught up in going deeper and deeper.

The way I justified it was access—a small price to pay. But then I realized J.T. was part of a larger structure, the [political] machine and the citywide gangs, that was raping Chicago's public housing. He was playing along to get along. He kept saying the gang was going to help the community, but I just didn't see it. I found that mythic and irresponsible.